Do engineers in your part of the world use Fahrenheit? Sounds exotic to a person living in the metric world.
Okay, there's been a lot of commentary on slashdot and other sites on why a REAL engineer would use FAKE / LAME units. This is the only response I'll give.
In my mind, a real engineer is capable of working with whatever is given to him. A good engineer might not do an exact sixteenth decimal place conversion, but a good engineer will know when a precise conversion is necessary and an imprecise one is acceptable. Most engineers are capable of working in whatever unit constraints are provided them and can think in US, metric, or SI. I have conversations with engineers from other countries routinely where we will both use inches, microns, degrees celcius, and pounds in the same conversation.
I happen to live (and cook) in the United States where we use a weird system involving seemlingly random and confusing units. So, I present my recipes with these units because I will be using these units when I cook.
Now scientists on the other hand are a different breed from engineers and will require SI units...
For the Yorkshire pudding, you have to ensure the fat is really hot before you add the pancake mix (which is all that yourshire pudding is) - hot as in at the point of smoking.
Also if you don't have dripping, use lard. Don't use butter.
I don't tie my roast, or sear it.
I use a 250F oven.
I slice under the layer of fat that is traditional on the outside of the roast and slip slices of garlic clove between the fat and the meat. I also do this with any 'center' fat - pierce between the fat and the meat with a knife and slide in garlic.
Then I make a mix of herbs, cracked pepper, and course grain 'kosher' salt. I roll the meat in this mixture, creating a crust. Then I place it bones down into a baking dish and bake until medium rare.
The above additions for a tasty crust sound yummy!
I have made Yorkshire pudding in individual portions using a 12-portion muffin pan with 1 teaspoon of pan drippings/muffin cup per the Good Housekeeping cookbook recipe.
Great site, Michael!
regarding the SI units topic...
My high school physics teacher would sometimes throw in problems using English units because he wanted the students to be able to solve problems using any kind of units, so he would probably agree with you here.
He did tell us a funny story of a one student who was against using English units. In protest, the student would convert any English units given to metric, solve the problem, then convert back to English units for the answer. =)
English, Metric, IS... all the same. Sure, depending on wich hemisphere or influence zone you're in, one gets used to one or another metric system.
As an engineer one is prepared to work in either system, but that also depends on tool graduation. I always use the KISS principle to work, trying to get good results in a short time. Converting units from a system to another is time consuming, so is better for me to work with raw units, be those celsius, fahrenheit, kelvin or rankine.
This recipee also looks tasty, I'll try to try it before year's end.
keep it up, mike.
KISS: Keep It Simple & Stupid
This is my family's traditional Christmas meal...hmmm I can smell it now!
(I have an enormous piece in my fridge right this minute, just waiting to be cooked and eaten!)
Mr. Cho, Merry Christmas to you and yours!
I think you should post the temperatures in Kelvin. Your stove DOES do Kelvin, right?
Just did a prime rib last night for Christmas Eve dinner - our roast was just a shade under 10 lbs. For the rub I used approximately 2 TB whole pepper and a scant 1 TB whole allspice; ground this in a mortar, added approximately 1 1/2 TB kosher salt, about a half-dozen garlic cloves, finely minced, 1/4 cup Dijon mustard, 1 TB dry mustard, and about 1 TB maple syrup. Mixed this together well, coated the roast with it and let is sit for about 1 1/2 hours before roasting. If I would have had more time, I would have let it marinate for a few hours more. Started it at 450F for 20 minutes, then lowered the heat to 250-275F until the internal temperature registerd 125F. Total cooking time was about 3 hours. Came out perfectly medium rare in the middle, with the end cuts at medium. The end cuts have a nice zing to them from the rub, while the middle slices had just enough seasoning without being too spicy.
Me again, stealing your recipes! They are excellent, that's why I keep coming back.
As an editor, I wish you would use the supercript o with F or C, with a space after the degrees number.
Also, what would help lots of us in uniformizing would be to use Tbsp for tablespoon and tsp for tsp. But this does not hurt one bit your excellent recipes.
Thanks!
Caroline
I don't believe an editor would use a word such as "uniformizing".
The cooking time is 3-4hours for the standing rib roast. If I dared to make it the night before, how could I re-heat it without ruining the rare-ness of it (the microwave cooks too well done from the inside out)
Any tips are appreciated - I am a first time S.R.R. cooker!! thanks
Good morning, Michael. In re Cooking temperature: In his "American Cookery" copyright 1972, chef James Beard offers a <preheated 180 to 200 degree oven> slow-roast method for standing rib, BUT he specifies "...roast without basting for approximately 23 to 24 minutes per pound, until it achieves an internal temperature of 120 to 125 degrees for rare meat; ..."
Your method specifies a far longer time per pound. How say you to Beard's time/pound? [I have not tried ANY low-heat method, only sear and temp reduce, etc]
Best regards & Happy Solstice: Nick F.
My estimate of 45 minutes per pound comes from how long it takes my 200°F oven to bring an eight pound roast to an internal temperature of 130°F. I took the totla time and divided by eight pounds. This has held true for the last two roasts that I prepared. (Usually, I tell my guests to show up at a certain time and that dinner will be done when it's done. I start preparing the final touches of the other dishes when the roast is sitting at 125°F - the last few degrees always seem to take forever.)
The extra ten degrees may account of some of the time discrepancy, but I doubt that it would double the time. I don't know what to say except, in my experience it takes closer to 45 minutes per pound to bring the roast to medium rare. Of course, I've always suspected that the minutes per pound estimate is a really bad hack as it's unlikely that the time it takes to heat a volume of meat is linear and predictable (what if my roast has more surface area than your roast?)... but that means a series of experiments that I cannot afford (both from a time and a money stand point) at this time in my life...
My thanks for your prompt response, Michael. And, indeed, the WEIGHT makes quite a difference, I'm sure. When I get very wealthy <it is to laugh>, I shall try experiments with roasts of approximately same geometry <and loin end, of course>, and approximate weights of, say, four pounds (2rib...tricky), six pounds (3rib) and eight pounds (4rib).
Your site is a total pleasure. Nick F.
I have a 14 lb prime rib (boneless) that needs to be cooked dec 24. I would like to seare it first at 450 for approx 25 minutes then reduce the heat to 250. I would like it cooked to a rare or med rare. I have no clue on any time estimate, can someone give me advice or help for my meat . I don't want to waste a lot of money or have Christmas eve dinner a disaster.
PLEASE HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I recommend you go to Bed Bath & Beyond or your local home kitchen supply store and buy a
probe thermometer like
this Polder model. Thrust the probe into the thickest part of the roast (parallel to the direction of how you will slice it in order to minimize the chance of having slices with holes in them later). Program the thermometer to go off
before your desired temperature (taking into account carryover temperature during the resting period). With a 250°F oven, I recommend setting the thermometer to 128°F. After the thermometer goes off, pull the roast out (leave the probe in) and tent with aluminum foil and let rest about 30 minutes (the final temperature should peak at just above 130°F - I expect about a three to four degree upswing in temperature when roasting at 250°F).
Now, timing is going to be a bit tricky with a roast that big... My semi-educated guess is that you'll need an additional 4-5 hours after your first roast at 450°F (less time if you left the roast in the oven during the cooling period when the oven temperature is dropping to 250°F.
You can also opt to finish the roast early, and then drop your oven to as low of a temperature as you can (mine goes down to 170°F) and keep the roast there to keep warm. When it comes time to serve, pull it out, let it rest for thirty, and serve.
I have only recently found this site, and have been much amused and informed by the bacon studies!
However the Rib Roast of 5KG looms for Boxing Day with some Claret and company. What I am fascinated by is the meat thermometer probe. Unfortunateley Polder can't be had in UK, but I shall have to seek an equivalent? What is the probe wire made of to resist the temperatures of the hot oven as it snakes out, presumably through the door seal?
Probably I won't find a thermometer in time for 26th Dec, but any help on sourcing similar in UK would be a help for next time.
Great fun site!
Iain
(I suggest Donald Russell Direct for UK beef)usual disclaimer
Hi I was reading your cooking method of a rib roast. I too cook it the way you do but I also rub the meat with a little Kitchen bouquet before I put in oven. I also use th eslices of garlic under the fat. Just thought you might want to try it.
Wow, I love this site! Very helpful, as I do not want to ruin an expensive cut of beef. I have never heard of slow roasting prime rib, only heating to sear, then turning the oven off. I'm thinking slow roasting is the way to go. Thanks for the info.
Any equivalent probe thermometer should work. I believe Kitchen Craft and Taylor both make products for sale in the UK.
This
one is available from Amazon.co.uk but I'm not sure you'll be able to get it in time for Dec. 25. You may have to go to the old standby of opening the oven door and shoving a thermometer into the roast every half an hour after the first couple hours.
I'm not sure what the probe wires are made of exactly. It looks and feels like the actual wires that conduct electricity are protected by a metal mesh that wraps around an insulator around the wire. The insulating substance is unknown to me. The cable does lead from the probe through the oven door seal to the thermometer unit.
Excellent site. My own experiance w/ the standing rib is very consistant w/ your recipe recomendations. I prefer to pre-heat to 500 degrees F, turn down to 200 degrees F , then place roast in oven v. the pan sear method. Reading the comments on cook time, I think you need to build your own data based on experiance ( engineering judgement). The ratio of surface area to mass, surface to center distance, bone configuration are all variables. Starting temp of the roast is a significant variable as well, although this one is under your control. For a first time chef, for meal planning purposes, I recommend 30' per pound for roasts under 6 lbs. 40 min for 8 lb. and up. You MUST monitor temp w/ an internal probe to determine actual degree of "doneness".:)
Guest cook:
I don't think anyone here would *recommend* pre-cooking your bad-a** standing rib roast, but sometimes one has to make concessions to the world.
I have found that your best bet is to probably cook it, let it rest until cool, and then slice it into the portion sizes you have in mind. Then the next day heat your oven to somewhere between 300oF and 400oF, place your slices between very large leaves of cabbage, then put the cabbage/cow packages into the oven on top of a rack placed within something to catch drippings.
How long? That's the tricky part. Until they are hot. For some reason, though, the cabbage keeps the slices from browning on the outside while they get nice and toasty.[/i]
Just came upon your website and although my roast is similar to some...I need help! Standing rib, 7 bones, 19 1/2 pounds!! I want to cook slow method at 250 degrees. How long do you think it will take?? Should I start today?? (: Would I be better off cutting it in half? Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Help! I have a 14 lb Standing Rib Roast and have no clue how to roast it. I feel I have read too many recipes and am extremely confused. Could someone give me a good clear recipe/ instruction to follow? I would appreciate any help. Thanks in advance.
Wow... as a former wannabe engineer turned to first love, music/singing/teaching (which really is engineering through and through)...
I was just innocently looking for research notes on the 'perfect' Prime Rib recipe (again) and I googled myself here and got sooo much more...
I am in total awe to witness such a marvelous site as this. I do have the analytical mind (to a fair extreme) surrounded by linear and 'anti-linear' thinking... along with a yearning for visuals, graphs, etc... love the photos and recipe cards.
And, I am LOL ('cuz I soo relate)... the 'engineerist' commentary, criticisms, and especially the temptations for further research and development... I am just baffled by those who forego the research for lack of proper funding? I was always led to believe that I would have had a far wealthier outcome as an engineer (compared to the 'starving' artist route I passed through). I'm wondering what happened... or what else is taking up all that funding that couldn't allow for a few to several prime ribs?
Thanks in metric and all other sorts of measurably huge amounts,
Cat
p.s. If the post is +/- 3:33pm Christmas Eve 'there'... it's 7:33am here... Curious to know where 'you' are... I'm an ex-wife/now better friend of a UK native (about 8 hours forward from us). In fact, he will be sharing the Rib Roast with me later today... and with far more laughs than when we were married.
:)
I'm not an engineer and I don't play one on tv, but I'm married to the daughter of one and hopefully that counts for something.
My question is;
I've read a lot about cooking rib roasts at the traditional 350 method. Has anyone tried the approach of searing at a high temp, then slow cooking at 200-250? This is supposedly the best approach for cooking a roast that is consistently cooked all the way through.
My boneless rib eye is 14lbs.
Any comments/advice greatly appreciated until count-down time; noonish tomorrow.
clayton01746@yahoo.com
[b:cb2777c9f4]Actually, my question should have read;
I've read a lot about cooking rib roasts at the traditional 350 method, and just read about the slow cooking 200-250 degree method. Given the two methods, what's the best approach for cooking a roast that is consistently cooked all the way through and tender??
My boneless rib eye is 14lbs.[/b:cb2777c9f4]
How long will it take a 12 lb standing rib roast (short end) to cook to rare to medium rare at 250 degreesin a convection oven?
Thank You!
Hi, I have a 4lb boneless prime rib roast. It came from the butcher tied together with a string "netting". What is the best way to cook it? I wanted to rub it with cracked black pepper & crushed garlic....Do I do this with the netting on it & then cut it off before serving? Or would it be better to remove the string netting, rub it & retie string around it in a few places?
Thanks in advance!
Sue
This reply is probably much too late to help anyone in their Christmas dinner in 2005 (sorry, I was out with my family on vacation - actually I still am on vacation...)
In answer to the last several questions (in random order):
The best recipe I know of for roasting a prime rib is the one detailed in this article - hands down, no competition.
How long do you need to cook a 12, 14, 19.5 lb. rib in a 200°F, 250°F, or X°F conventional or convection oven? I have no idea - sorry. Please see my earlier comment on the difficulty in assessing the exact time of doneness and the reliance on a probe thermometer. You can do what great prime rib restaurants do - cook it early and then keep it warm for in a really low temperature oven (170°F or lower if your oven can do it).
String nettings? If you want to add a spice rub, remove the netting, apply the rub, and then retie between the ribs.
I hope everyone is having a Merry Christmas regardless of how your standing rib roasts came out. :) It's all about being with family, friends, or your community, right? Speaking of which, mine is calling for me to return to them...
Oh, by the way, I'm in the U.S. Pacific Time Zone. I believe the forums default to GMT if you haven't set your time preferences in your profile.
In the interest of adding to your data on various sizes of roasts and cooking times: I cooked a 4.11 lb. Ribeye Roast at 200 degrees F for 3 hours. I removed it from the oven when my quick read thermometer registered 128 degrees because I like my meat just slightly under medium rare. The meat was exactly to my liking - though I did not see the 10 degree rise in temperature that was supposed to have occured while my meat was resting for 20 minutes. Thank you for your excellent web site. I love your logical approach to cooking.
Signed -- The wife of an engineer in Ohio.
I ran into the problem of redicting how long it would take to cook the roast. My instructions were to have the 7 lb standing rib roast ready and med-rare by 4pm on Xmas day. Different recipes and instructions all seemed to give inconsistent cooking times. So my scientist neice and I decided to collect some data so that we would have some info to go on next year. Here's our experience. We recorded all temperatures using a Williams-Sonoma temperature probe with remote readout. All measurements were taken with the probe inserted to the center of the roast. Our oven is a standard GE electric oven - no convection.
I pulled the roast out of the fridge one hour before cooking time. During this time the center temperature barely changed: started at 43 F and after one hour it was 45 F. No surprising, but clearly the phrase "getting it to room temperature" more of a saying that truth.
I first cooked the roast for 10 minutes at 450 F. The temperature increase picked up. After 10 minutes we were at 47F.
I then lowered the oven setting to 250 F and let it roast slowly. Now the center temperature really began heating up and at a relatively constant rate. From 47 F to about about 100 F the rate was about 1.5 min/deg F. After 100 F it begins to slow at bit, but not dramatically. I had an average rate of 1.9 min/F toward the end of the oven time. We pulled it out when the probe hit 125 F after an oven time of 2 hours 41 minutes (10 min at 450 F, 2 hr 30 min at 250 F).
Average cooking times were:
23.1 min/lb to get to a center temperature of 125 F
21.8 min/lb to get to a center temperature of 121 F
The surprising part of this was how much the center temperature increased after we removed the roast from the oven. I had read in one recipe that it would increase 5 F and in another recipe that it would increase 5 to 10 F. We saw an increase of 13F up to 138F. This occurred over a period of 43 minutes.
I was a bit concerned that the 138 F center temperature would push me past our goal of med-rare and squarely into med territory, but 138 F seemed perfect. The meat was evenly pink throughout and plenty tender.
For future reference, I plan to stick with the 450 F / 250 F method and to estimate times using the average cooking rates above plus an allowance of 45 minutes "set up time" after it comes out of the oven.
Happy eating.
Following the recipe detailed above, you should not have much carryover temperature increase. It might increase 1-2 degrees. Carryover temperature increases are caused by having a temperature gradient within the roast causing the interior to continue to rise in temperature while the exterior just begins to cool. The 200°F roasting method has very little difference in temperature from the very center to the semi-center, so not much carryover cooking occurs.
I hoist my whiskey glass to you Mr. Chu,
Excellent recipe. We followed the instructions as posted.
8 lb'er and it turned out perfect. I had so many compliments.
Cooking time was about an hour less than calculated using a coventional natural gas oven.
Next time I do this I will grab the data logger from work and instrument the cooking process.
Any recommendations for how to reheat the leftovers from a standing rib roast??
Reheating without cooking the roast further is a difficulty. Slice off the amount of roast that you want to reheat, slip into a Ziploc bag, seal, and drop into hot tap water (about 120-140°F). The water will gently reheat the meat without pushing it into well done status (like a microwave oven would). The amount of time it takes to reheat to eating temperature varies depending on the thickeness of cut and how cold it was when you started to warm it up. Exchange the water even ten minutes or so to keep the water temperature up.
Man, engineers are a whiny bunch. Just cook! (I realize humor may have been intended but....) This is a good recipe.
I read your excellent detailed recipe, I am also an engineer..I am wondering how do you slice the meat piece after cooking it.Do you have to remove the bone first?..how do you do that?
Thanks
Yes, remove the bones first by cutting along the inside of the ribs around the rib roast itself. If you have a small roast, you can cut off all the ribs at once, but if your roast is very large, then you may need to cut off thee or four at a time. After the ribs have been removed, you can separate the ribs by splitting them with a sharp knife (just run the knife between the ribs). These are seriously delicious pieces of meat for the more adventurous party members (meaning - guests who don't mind getting their hands dirty).
Once the ribs have been removed, take the roast and start at the cut end, use a long sharp knife and slice the roast. The slices can be thick or thin, but should be cut straight across the roast. (Two ends of your roast came already cut, just follow the same direction of cut and work your way across the roast.)
Lots of methods,times & temps abound. As an engineer, I was inspired by an old issue of Cooks Magazine. They did the complete matrix experimentally, buying 20+ rib roasts and cooking with all the permutations people seem to use. The hands-down winner (they compared to the best restaurant roast), was a few minutes to brown on the stove, then in to a 200-degree oven until 130 or so for medium rare. There will be little or no temp runup during resting. It comes out perfectly uniform from end-to-end and from outer to inner, no Medium spots. I've been using this for 8 years and never had anything less than rave reviews.
Pad
If you sear on top of the stove first, (I have a nice big cast iron skillet), then would you put the same cast iron skillet into the oven or switch to a nice shiny roasting pan? (If the latter, I would assume save the skillet, deglaze later and add to the other pan drippings for jus or gravy).
Also, if switching to a roasting pan, do you lightly oil the pan first or not?
Or do you brown on the stove in a roasting pan rather than cast iron?
You have a great site. The replies have been great in helping me evaluate the options and prepare a wonderful New Years day meal. Since really good engineers share data, here is some input for the file. I used a bone in roast that started out just below 6# and aged it for 6 days in the fridge covered with cheese cloth. At cooking time it weighed 5.5#. At 1 1/2 hrs out of the fridge it only rose to 47 F. I browned it on all sides in a pan, rubbed it with garlic and seasoned with salt and pepper. In a shallow, ceramic pan, on a rack and with a 225F oven the internal temp rose to 127 in 3 hours, about 26 degrees per hour. After 45 minutes of resting, temp was 132. The ribs were trimmed off for eaier slicing. The first cut revealed a perfect, juicy, medium pink center. One of the guests liked theirs more done than rare so I put an end slice under the broiler, cut side up for more doneness. The flavor and taste was everything hoped for and all of my guests could not believe how good it was. The two bottles of Shiraz may have helped. It served six people (about 1/2" to 3/4" slices) with a little left over. This recipe is a keeper and will become a New Years standard for us. Thanks to all the contributors who helped make this possible.
I usually sear on a different pan than the one I roast on. You can definitely use the same pan, but remember to elevate the roast on a grill so the drippings can fall into the pan (away from the roast).
I do not bother to oil the pan that I am searing on. When you sear the roast, just let it sit for a minute or two on each side. When that side has seared, it will release from the pan easily.
This was one of the first articles I wrote for Cooking For Engineers. Upon rereading it, I think I'm going to have to rewrite parts of it and add more information (and definitely a lot more pictures).
:huh: silly a question as it may be...what is the cooking time @ 200F if I have two 6.25lb standing ribs in the roater???
I've only done two roasts at the same time once. That time, the roasts took the same amount of time as when I roast one - about 45 minutes per pound - so about 4-1/2 to 5 hours.
I'd appreciate others who have tried this to comment on their experience.
I was very glad to find your site today while looking for a new Salmon receipe. I have been married to an engineer for 34 years and he has a million reasons why not to cook.
Your site has come to my rescue. It if perfect for the analytical mind.
Awesome site, being an Engineer, I was immediately drawn in, trying the pan seared red pepper recipe tonight. My problem is however prime rib, cook it once a year, Xmas, and the last two years I have had 12 lb roast go beyond the desired temp. Cooking 20 mins a pound (200F)(boneless in both cases) it was flagrantly overcooked to well done! This year bought a new poke in thermometer (will buy one you can leave in) and thinking I was being extra cautious, bought a oven monitoring gauge (hangs on the oven rack) to make sure my oven temp was correct. A desparity of 25- 30 degrees! I see no mention of matching temp setting , new oven this year (dacor) - any experince with that? Do you think it was all about being boneless? - jokes expected...... Thanks
I've done prime rib on a rotisserie 4 times now and agree with the theory that it's done when it's done. This weekend is an annual poker tournament I attend and feel that it will be easier said than done. I use a Weber grill and turn off the middle and back burners for a slow 225 degree roast. The hardest part is keeping early poker turnouts from opening up and looking.
We are planning on posting a bouncer (6'2" hockey player/ civil engineer) nearby, but fear his legendary appetite might create a conflict.
I will post our results.
This may seem a sacrilege to some, but our favorite part of our slow-cooked rib roasts is the sandwiches we make from the leftovers. We make two kinds -
HOT ROAST BEEF - Make a good gravy, get it bubbling hot, slice the meat thin, make a great slice of toast, use tongs to dunk the slices and load them onto the toast. The goal is to get them hot without further cooking.
ROAST BEEF DIP - Make a good au jus, get it bubbling hot, slice the meat thin, slice open a hearty sanwich roll, dunk it and then dress it as desired (we add nothing), use tongs to dunk the roast slices and load them onto the sandwich. As always, the goal is to get the sliced meat hot without further cooking.
Contract designers would be cooking and eating a fillet.
Though I'm merely a lowly technician, I gravitate toward the scientific perspective on most of the answers needed to respond to the questions here. I wonder why some simple physics isn't appied here. The same science which is appied to baking pastries and custards is also appropiate to roasting, braising, broiling, broasting, frying, boiling, steaming, sauteeing, and anything else I might have forgotten. This would consist of the variables BTU output of the appliance, density, volume, and water content of the item being cooked. There are minor considerations such as the temperature coefficient of the medium conducting the heat and the rate of the heat transfer, but in order to hypothosize a universal formula for cooking a piece of meat to the desired state would require the careful collection of data under controlled conditions. Cooking is an art that is not immune from the laws of physics and physics underlie_ the principles of everything. Ya think?
This roast will never be done. You Engineers will debate conversion and physics until the roast is well done and no one will eat it.
Time to take it out of the oven. (ha ha)
Chuck, Manufacturing guy.
ps: I really like the garlic idea. Niuce touch!
That's why I recommend the use of a probe thermometer. That way, I can set it and forget it as I argue / discuss with my friends about the merits of using low heat vs. high heat roasting and start a pool going with the various estimates of when it will be done. If we get carried away, the BEEP BEEP BEEP from the Polder will tell me to come back to reality and pull the roast out of the oven. :)
My convection oven at 200°F took 4 hours to roast a 9.5 pound rib roast from 37°F to 130°F, as measured by both a thermocouple (accurate to +/- 0.1°F) and a remote sensor digital oven thermometer (Pyrex professional brand +/- 1°F). Another thermocouple with a 'gas' (open grid) sensor confirms that the thermostat on the convection oven is accurate.
So, I have to go with James Beard (and the New Joy of Cooking) for these times, at least in my convection oven.
Delicious! Thanks for the article and the comments!
:) That was the best prime rib I have ever cooked. The recipe is simple and delicious. Thank for the great meal. Also, I would agree that the thermometer made the difference, although the 45 minutes per hour was right on.
The sirloin tip roast (AKA round tip roast, AKA beef knuckle) is cut from the front of the leg, the area from the hip to the knee. It is not associated with the rib.
Very Good recipie for any cut, try it with "Chuck" or any other cut that has good "Marbeling" works the same, shorter cooking times. Be sure to increase the "Done" temp with smaller pieces. as they don't retain as much heat. Never over 138 before removing it if you like rare.
For everyone talking about the time to cook, I think only one person got it right, buy an independant thermometer. You oven can be off by as much as 30 degrees. This can make a huge difference in cooking time. Also I do mine a little backwards 200 until roast is @110 then crank it up to 500 to put a nice crust on it (about 10 minutes & use your eyes if it looks cruty enough it is) then pull out and let stand at least 30 minutes. This will make a rare roast, with a very crusty outside.
Wowza!
I'm an engineer and always looking for the "right" way to do things...so this site is very helpful. Last night I did a 3-rib (6-lb) roast on a VT Castings BBQ grill - my first cooking on it! It was for a guests 60th birthday, so I was a bit nervous, but went for it anyway. After letting the roast come to room temp and tying it up, I rubbed-on some olive oil and seared the roast over direct flame for 3-minutes on each side. Then I rubbed it with coarse sea salt, fresh ground pepper and a little paprika. I placed the roast on a rack in a pan over the center of the grill (no cover on the roasting pan of course), shut off the two center burners and left the two outer burners on their lowest settings. An oven thermometer placed on the "floor" of the rack inside the roasting pan measured 200F, and the thermometer on the exterior of the grill hood measured 350F. Now, mind you, the grill thermometer is up high near the end of the hood so it was measuring directly over a burner. At any rate, the meat was done to 130F in exaclty 2.5 hours. At that point I opened the grill lid, placed the cover on the roast pan and let it sit for 30-minutes.
I carved the roast by slicing the ribs off the back, and then sliced nice "typical" rib cuts to serve. OUTSTANDING! I was a little worried because the roast cooked faster than this site suggests, but except for the outer 1/8-inch around, EVERY BIT of the roast was perfectly medium rare. The guests went nuts. My wife loved it, and my two young children couldn't get enough.
Tonight I basted the ribs up with BBQ sauce and grilled them for about 7-minutes on each side. They were super-yummy, although next time 'round I'll cook them a little longer - I like my ribs done more than I do my prime rib.
Hi. Recently ate at Sanfords Pub and Grub in Spearfish S.D.They make the best prime rib that I've had in a restaurant. I ordered the prime rib rare. I happened to have a view of the kitchen, over a counter,and watched as the chef took what appeared to be an already cooked cold roast,cut off a thick piece and that was all I could see. My meal came and the prime rib was as I had ordered it. Any ideas as to how it was heated back up?
Most restaurants that serve prime rib keep the cooked rib roast under heat lamps or in a special "oven" that maintains the temperature at around 120°F so it stays hot but doesn't rise in temperature.
Some restaurants will prepare several roasts of varying doneness while other restuarants will cook the roast at higher temperatures to get a larger area of medium vs. medium-rare vs. rare and will cut the roast at different points to serve depending on your request. This usually means the rare or medium-rare roasts are not as good as they could have been where a restuarant specifically prepared an entire roast for that target temperature.
Thanks for the reply Michael. After reading your original post on how to cook prime rib, I can't wait to try it.Thinking of maybe giving it a try this weekend. Wondering if you have ever tried to barbecue prime rib and if so. how would you do it. I have heard of using a drip pan with some water or cooking wine,etc in it ,and placing the pan on top of the coals. Then the roast is placed on top of the grid and slowly cooked.Ken
We go out for a delicious prime rib. I think it is boiled. Is that possible? Is there a recipe available for boiled prime rib. I visited your site today for the first time looking for such a recipe. Would love to try it at home.
I happened in to this great website while searching for a coherent clam chowder recipe. I love it. I cook prime rib very often and use a modification of the sear and slow roast technique that seems to greatly enhance the natural juice retention of the meat. I place the roast on a roasting rack so the bone side is above the roasting pan surface. I preheat the oven to 450 F and then place the pan in the middle. When I first hear a sizzling sound, about 6-10 minutes I reduce the heat to 200 F. I personally use a convection oven but this is not necessary. Here is where I vary from what has been suggested. Using an instant read thermometer rather than one placed in the roast, I start monitoring the center temp of the roast after it has been in the oven about 18-20 minutes per pound. When the central temperature reaches 118-120 F I remove the roast and wrap it in aluminum foil and place it on a plate in a non energized microwave (serves only as a wll insulated space), or a good cooler that is obviously without ice. In about 30 minutes, the roast will be uniformly on the rare side of medium rare. With a good quality true prime rib this is perfect for many but you can wait to remove the roast until the central temp is 122-124 F for a slightly less rare result. Removing the roast from heat early and letting the cooking process continue virtually eliminates the loss of juices (get some good stock for your gravy) and yields an incredibly uniform result.
Give it a try
Dr. J
There are a lot of comments here from folks that just don't seem to understand engineers. Without further noise:
Source: Whole Foods
Cost: $62
Size: 7lbs (3 ribs, cut from the loin end, which the butcher was happy to do)
Preparation: wrap in towel, place in fridge for 3 days
Day of consumption:
09:21 - 34° - removed from fridge
11:00 - 38°
11:30 - 41°
12:00 - 44° - browned 3 minutes per side, 5 sides on med-high heat
12:30 - 49° - into a 200° oven
13:30 - 78° -
14:00 - 93° -
15:00 - 114° -
16:00 - 130° - removed from oven
16:15 - 134° -
16:30 - 134° - undercooked - returned to 200° oven
17:00 - 138° - removed from oven and carved
Browning and cooking were done in a 10" Cast Iron Dutch Oven in which the roast barely fit. After browning, I inserted a heavy foil pie pan, inverted and cut to fit, with hole punched in it so the juices could drain. Browning rendered a fair bit of fat.
Temperatures were measured using the oven thermometer (+10/-1°), a calibrated over thermometer (+/- 1°), and a Maverick remote probe thermometer (+/- 2°, tested with ice & boiling water) inserted between two of the ribs, with the end of the probe centered in the roast.
After going back in the oven for 1/2 hour and raising the temp to 138°, we had perfect deep pink prime rib, all the way through. I just finished warming up a piece in a ziplock, in hot water, like Michael recommends. Excellent.
Hi Michael;
I just now happened upon your Cooking For Engineers site. I am so glad you created this for us analytical minded people. I am about to prepare a standing rib roast for Thanksgiving for some friends. I have a handwritten (by me) recipe from my father who was a cook in the army in WWII. He loved to cook and continued in that industry all his career after the war. He died several years ago and this is the first time I am attempting this recipe without him here to call on the phone for walk-through advise.
My notes on how to cook the standing prime rib are jumbled - out of character for an analytical mind. But it is because I had to take notes as he talked. He spoke like an artist but he had analytical spurts. I am also a map (visual) person, so you can see why the notes are a mish mash of analytical-visual-artistic learning/communicating styles. Because of this I had to check out the web for help to interpret my own notes. And miraculously there's your website - waiting just for me. I love it! Your link is now saved to my desktop! I am now able to rearrange my notes and answer my question marks (200 degrees or not) (Kosher salt before or after searing) etc. Thank you for this website!
Robyn
from Florida
Mr. Chu,
your reponse is perfect. Lazy engineers complain about conversion when dealing w/ international "algorithms or recipes". Lucky for me, i'm a lazy engineer, that happens to use the same units as you do. (SWEET). Great recipe. I agree whole heartidly, all ya need for a good cut of meat is salt, pepper and and a low temperature.
I'd like to try this method and was wondering if i use a cut of meat that does not have bones attached will my cooking time still be 40-45 minutes per pound? (I hope to find an 8lb roast)
Thank you!
For the last few years I have been attempting to recapture the flavor of the standing rib roast my grandmother cooked in the late 1950s and early 1960s. She grew up on a farm in Wyoming and raised three kids on a farm in Nebraska through the Depression. A stroke ended her speech when I was too young to have extracted her recipes from her head, because she never wrote anything down. I have solved the corn pudding recipe (just Google "Memphis Corn Pudding") but have yet to have cracked the rib roast or the dinner rolls.
Anyway, in addition to Michael's searing-and-200 method (with the searing coming either through a skillet or a 500-degree oven), I have found two other methods that have produced interesting results (still not Grandma's though):
Wannabe food scientist Alton Brown reverses the searing-and-200 method with a long, slow cook, a rest and then a quick 500-degree flash at the end:
http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/recipes/recipe/0,,FOOD_9936_17372,00.html Without the terracota pot I tried this to OK results; maybe you really need the pot.
Ina Gartner (Barefoot Contessa) is a 350-degree gal, though she varies that a bit as well:
http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/recipes/recipe/0,,FOOD_9936_25276,00.html. I found the meat less tender than in the sear-and-slow method.
The aforementioned James Beard also proposes that a three- or four-rib roast can be cooked thusly: For a 7:30 p.m. dinner, do the normal seasoning and place the roast in a 375-degree oven at 11:30 a.m.; shut off the oven (but leave the roast inside) at 12:30 p.m. At 6 p.m., turn the oven again at 375 for another hour, pull the roast out and let it rest for 30 minutes. I've never tried this one.
I've given up on both analog and digital quick-read thermometers and am ordering a Poulder today, with the understanding that the Poulter probe wires eventually burn out. A new wire and probe costs $15, while the whole shebang costs $10. You've got to love American consumer society.
Thanks.
\dmc
Help. I am picking up a full standing (ribs in) prime rib that my butchers says will weigh in at about 22lbs. Based on everything I have read through this great forum, are my calculations correct in assuming it will take almost 10 hours at 200 degrees F? Could I achieve the same slow cook effect by turning my heat up to-say 225 degrees to shave off a few minutes (hours) of cooking time? Thanks in advance, Michael
Wow michael, 22lbs? I seriously doubt your roast will take 10 hours. The largest one I roasted was 12lbs. That one took 5 hours @150*F. My experience is that as rib roasts get larger they get longer but not much thicker. The largest rib roast I've seen had a diameter of about 8".
Your oven heat has to penetrate a thickness of 3 to 4 inches of protein (the radius of the cross section of the joint), regardless of weight.
This year I have an oven that allows me to roast as low as 125*F. I plan on searing the roast in the oven at 525*F for 15 minutes then turn the temperature to 125*F (my target internal temp) for the remainder of the cooking time.
I'll start it earlier than usual. If internal temperature reaches 125* early, no big deal, I'll just leave it in the oven until we serve it. Internal temperature is not going to rise any higher. At that temp. the roast won't need to rest.
Michael, my 12 pound roast was about 16" in length. I'm really interested in knowing the dimensions of your roast when you get it (length/diameter).
Thanks
Expecting to feed 18 adults for Christmas dinner. What size Rib roast should I buy?
azmomof5,
Provided that you're serving side dishes and trimmings, 0.75lb servings should be adequate. That translates to 13 to 14lb roast.
.
If Prime Rib is your only entree - expect to feed 2 people per rib. Usually, my dinner guests end up consuming only about 1/4 to 1/3 rub per person with a mixed group and a variety of food available (some take 1-in. cuts while others split a 1/4-in. cut). If all your guests are hearty eaters - you'll basically need two roasts going at the same time.
Hi - We have an 18.72 lb rib roast to cook for christmas eve. My plan is to roast at 200 starting at midnight and expect the roast to be medium rare and remove from oven approx 2 pm., let stand 1 hour and carve at 3 pm. Do I have it right? :huh:
Crash, thanks for your reply. 17 inches by 8.5 inches in diameter. Weighing in at 20.5 lbs. I like your idea of cooking at 125 degrees. Unfortunately I just checked my over and it only goes down to 175 degrees. But I am going to try your system. Here is my big dilemma folks. I am serving dinner for friends at 7:00PM. I’m trying to calculate my cooking time at 20.5 lbs at 175 degrees to get an internal temp of 130 degrees. Any suggestions on the approximate cooking time per pound? Thanks to all, and to all a good night. Happy Holidays. Michael
I am glad I found this site - many great ideas. I have a couple of questions if anyone can help. I ordered a 16lb prime rib for Christmas Eve dinner and picked it up today. It is off the bone and not what I expected. It is roughly 18" long by 10" and about 2.5" to 3" thick. It is it best to roll it up and tie it or just cook it as is? Will this affect the cooking times discussed above?
Following your recipe or directions, it was the best prime rib I ever cooked!
I have some leftovers and would like to serve it again, but I have always had trouble with the meat getting too tough and/or too dry. What is your suggestions in reheating the perfect medium rare meat????
The very best method that I've used is bagging the meat in a zip top bag and weighting ti down so it's submerged in very hot (but not boiling) water. The time it takes to reheat varies according tot he thickenss of the cut and the temperature it was when it went into the water, but, generally, after 30 minutes or so, the meat is nicely warmed up without continuing to cook it.
Microwaving also works fairly well if the meat has relatively warm to begin with (or has warmed up froma bagged soak in hot water). If it takes longer than 1 minute to heat up with the microwave, it's not a good solution - but if the meat is room temperature and you want to quickly bring it up to eating temperature, about 30 seconds in the microwave works without over cooking parts of the beef.
I am an engineer with a degree in Bio-Medical Engineering from Duke. This approach permeates almost everything I do.
I cooked 2 such roasts lately: one on Christmas day and one night before last for a party. I used the recipe in the December 2006 Gourmet which cooked in 2½ hours at 350º F. The experiment I did was to use a 4 rib piece of real prime beef for Christmas and choice beef for the party. The choice beef was half as expensive at $9/lb and it tasted better. I know that the pleural of anecdote is not data, but I will not feel like I am missing anything by using choice beef again.
Sincerely yours,
Ed Warren
There are only 10 kinds of people in the world, those who understand binaries and those who do not.
Used this recipe last night for the first time, and wanted to thank you for such simple advice. My rib roast came out beautifully and my husband, who loves prime rib, was greatly satisfied.
Keep up the good work! :)
I'm going with a 19.5 lbs. Searing 20 mins at 450 F, then bringing it down to 250 F. Cooking it to an internal Temp of 130 F. A little confused as to the approximate cooking time. How long will this take to cook?
Did the cooking time of 14 hours at 200 F work out?
Hi. Have you tried covering roast with layer of rock salt,kosher salt,or sea salt. Just wondering what the salt does , what temp to cook at and how does the roast turn out using this method. Thanx.
To everyone who posted data on this site I feel as though a thank you is in order. My eveneing is winding down after an all day battle that I feel you are the heroes of. I somewhat unexpectedly found myself with a 20# standing rib that needed cooking. I am no stranger to cooking beef but I have always had my home-grown beef butchered and cut the prime into rib steaks.
Last night I found this site and imediately felt at ease. I printed the entire chat log and decided to get up early on the morning of my maiden prime voyage and decide a plan of attack for my 5:30 dinner for 15. After reading the entire chat log I decided to use a little of everyones input. With only 6 hours until crunch time a 200 temp was out, even so I read one entry championing a 250-275 temp and from what I learned on this site it seemed the lowest temp possibility at my disposal.
Used a minced garlic, prepared mustard, powdered mustard, worschestershire, red pepper, chile pepper, onion salt, "If it sounds good it probably is rub".
Set my propane grill up to high used extra virgin olive oil in an aerosol can to coat the roast and generously sprinkled the roast with course salt and fresh ground pepper, then seared it over the flames on all sides.
Preheated indoor oven to 265, rubbed seared roast with afore-mentioned rub and placed on a "rack" of onion slices one-half to three-quarters an inch thick. I made a rack of onion because I didn't have a metal rack and thought the au jus would benefit anyway. "side note, temp of 265 will not burn onions".
Roasted in convection oven at 265 for 5 hours until internal thermo read 125. Served with a 1cup mayo, 1half cup horseradish, 1 tbsp fresh lemon juice and salt to taste sauce to be slathered, au jus also.
Knocked everyones socks of including mine. Thank you everyone who shared their experience it truly made ours.
I love the site (and I'm an engineer!) Incidentally, if you have a Kitchenaid Mixer you might really like the KitchenAid Cookbook they sell. I love it. The bread recipes say things like "turn it on speed 2 for 2 minutes" instead of "process it until it looks doughy and elastic" ;-) I do much better with the objective data instead of just subjective descriptions...they frustrate me.
Anyway, I tried my very first prime rib last night. Thanks to all who have contributed to this site. The truth is that my cooking of it didn't match my plan...the evening got all crazy...but despite this, the roast turned out fabulous and I figured I'd add to the data.
It was a 4.34 lb choice standing rib roast...4 bones I think. A little roast.
I preheated the oven to 450 degrees F (conventional). As soon as I put the roast in, I turned it down to 200 degrees F. I skipped the searing on the stove...running late..and didn't use a rack...just put in a baking pan and that seemed to work fine. There wasn't that much grease.
It cooked at 200 degrees for 2 hours 27 mins. Then I panicked and turned the oven up to 350 degrees because it was getting really late. It cooked at 350 degrees for 30 minutes. At that point, my cheap thermometer said it was 120 degrees in the center but I took it out anyway. I didn't let it rest, and just served it. It came out nicely pink nearly throughout, with good browning on the outside. About 1/2" around the outside edge was well done. It was somewhere between rare and medium-rare...perfect for me. When I went to slice the remainder of the roast after supper I noticed it was much more done...medium-rare or maybe a bit more...light pink throughout but no red...so clearly the center had heated up a bit more while sitting on the serving plate (if it had rested, I think the whole thing would have gone to that).
So...don't be overly intimidated by your first attempt, and know that all is not lost if your plan goes awry.
I just ordered a probe thermometer (they had it at Bed Bath & Beyond and Target) that includes a wireless remote unit you can take with you to monitor the temp of the roast and hear the alarm sound (I would have trouble hearing a timer go off in the kitchen). You can even clip this device to your belt so you don't wander away from it. (I'm still pretty easily flustered in my attempts to entertain people in my home).
I just thought I'd add to the data (even if the whole thing was a bit haphazard!)
I'll do this again!
Ellen
It should be noted that this process is relatively difficult to get wrong. As I see it you can only mess it up if you do one of the following three things:
1. Burn the meat. i.e. Letting the internal temp get above 140F.
2. Not letting the meat rest after cooking.
3. Burn the meat. i.e. Turning the outside to charcoal.
The first one is easy. Use a probe thermometer and count on carry-over heating: I usually count on about 3% of the difference of the temperature. e.g. 200F oven for a 125F roast results in 75F x 3% = 2.25F carry-over. 300F oven for a 125F roast results in 175F x 3% = 5.25F carry-over. This is most valid for large roasts which are longer than they are thick. Your mileage may vary.
The second one is a little more tricky. When do you know you've let it rest enough? I wait until the inner temperature finishes rising and drops back to the temperature at which I pulled it out of the oven. e.g. I pull the roast at 125F. It rises to 128F. So I have to wait until the temperature drops back to 125F. Note: This could easily take an hour or more on a large piece of meat.
<scienceContent>
The third one is simple in execution but complex scientifically. It has to do with the complex chemical reactions of the Maillard and caramelization reactions. The process turns the proteins and sugars in the meat into more complex compounds which are generally brown in color. Cook too hot for too long and the outside will turn black and burn.
These reactions start at temperatures as low as 230-250F and occur at a faster rate as the temperature goes up.
</scienceContent>
So generally it is a good idea to not roast at a temperature above 250F. Also, remember that a lower temperature is better because cooking a roast is not all that different from cooking a custard:
The faster you cook, the more protein coagulation you're going to get and as a result you will wring out more water from the meat. This usually means that even with a proper resting period, more of the juice of the meat will run out onto the plate when the roast is served.
So if you have the time, cook slower. Even slower than 200F if your oven can manage it. Just make sure that you set the temperature at or above the final doneness temperature of the meat (i.e. above 127F for medium-rare).
Also, use an oven thermometer. Ovens suck, especially at low temperatures. At least borrow one from a friend to prove to yourself that you actually need one. I'm betting you do.
1. Have the meat pre sliced into portions.
2. Let it get at room temp.
3. Place the portions in an aju on a low simmer until heated through
4. Serve
That would be how we did it at the restaraunt I worked at.
Hey,
I a not an "engineer" by education, but I am an "engineer" by motherhood. LOL...Great site. I do this Prime Rib Roast. I leave mine frozen, crust it in course salt and fresh course ground pepper. Wrap it in tinfoil and I cook it @ 250 degrees for 6 hours. It is GREAT!!!! Crusted with flavor and juice. It turns out med rare. Just wanted you to know.
:P
I let roast rise to room temp on the counter. Slightly dampen the outside then roll in rock salt. Pat it on like a shell. Add coarse ground black pepper to shell. Place in oven at 450 degrees for 15 or so minutes. Turn oven down to 200 and roast til meat thermometer is at desired temp. Quicker and easier than browning in the pan. It browns in hot oven and salt seals in juices. To serve, break away salt shell.
Has anyone used the prime rib cooking specs on a steak? The prime rib turned out excellent. I was just wondering how a steak, say, 2 lb, would turn out.
This is actually an excellent way to prepare a steak if you're not doing it on a grill. Just sear both sides of the steak in some butter or oil - about 3 to 4 minutes each side. Slip it into a 200°F oven until done to degree you desire. Because it's not easy to get a probe thermometer to sit in the steak and produce accurate temperatures, I recommend using a fast thermometer, like the Thermapen, and measuring every few minutes (depending on how close you are to your target temperature). There will be minimal amount of carry over cooking, so you can take it out when it hits your mark. If the steak it too thin, then the high temperature sear might put you over your intended doneness, so watch out for that.
Thanks for your prompt reply on cooking steaks. GC
Just wanted to let you know that I tried your slow cooking method on a 3.75 lb Prime Rib Roast and it was incredible. I actually cooked it in a roasting pan on the BBQ. It was very easy and kept the oven free for the rest of the dinner. I am looking forward to trying this out with a much larger roast for company now.
Thanks for the great website.
I've done this recipe, and it's great. But, being particular about temperature, I do all my cooking using old William John Macquorn Rankine's scale. Just because I can.
I flipped to this thread because I am making a standing rib roast on the grill using a rotisserie this afternoon and needed to check on a couple of details. My post here is completely off topic, but being a metric-o-phile, is there is such a word, I had to respond. I've said before I detest the system of weights and measures we use in the US, and can't wait for a change, but I know we are going to be stuck with it for a long time. BUT, with regard to accuracy and precision in engineering and architecture, everyone should be reminded that the Empire State Building, the Golden Gate Bridge (among many other structures in the modern world) and going to the moon, were all done with a slide rule (what's that? say the kids), and three significant figure accuracy, not to mention a lot of know-how. Cooking is one of those things where know how (or knowing where to get the information) is what makes the difference between a cook that knocks out mediocre meals, and a cook, trained or not, that seeks out information that they need to know to produce a delicious meal that everyone will enjoy.
Thanks to everyone for this great thread!
I can't wait to try this method of cooking rib!
I was of course being facetious, tongue in cheek so to speak, about using the Rankine scale to cook with. I actually prefer to use the Romer or even the Reaumer scales, but my glass thermometers calibrated in those obscure units are to valuable to use for cooking. Even for a Standing Rib Roast! :P
Now the Reaumur scale is just as detestable to me as the Fahrenheit/Rankine scales. Where do these guys get their motivation to make these ridiculous scales? Lets here it for Celsius and Kelvin. Go metric!
I have to say I am VERY impressed that you have Reaumur scale thermometers. They are probably extremely valuable, at leasts to nuts like us.
I would like to ask, is it ok to age a defrost prime rib before cooking.
I wouldn't age a defrosted prime rib before cooking it. I don't anyone who has the facility to truly age a piece of beef at home. Besides, if I was going to take the time and go to the significant expense of preparing a prime rib/standing rib roast, and then take the credit or blame for its outcome, I would just purchase exactly what I wanted when I was ready to prepare and serve it.
Thanks Gray,
Since I am not living in US, it is very hard to find unfrozen USDA Prime beef. The roast selling here is un-aged, frozen one, so I just want to find out is that any way I can improve it favour. Anyway, thanks for your comment.
[i:8fec73f8db]On August 14, 2006 at 09:26 PM, Michael Chu said...
Anonymous wrote:
I happened to have a view of the kitchen, over a counter,and watched as the chef took what appeared to be an already cooked cold roast,cut off a thick piece and that was all I could see. My meal came and the prime rib was as I had ordered it. Any ideas as to how it was heated back up?
Most restaurants that serve prime rib keep the cooked rib roast under heat lamps or in a special "oven" that maintains the temperature at around 120°F so it stays hot but doesn't rise in temperature.
Some restaurants will prepare several roasts of varying doneness while other restuarants will cook the roast at higher temperatures to get a larger area of medium vs. medium-rare vs. rare and will cut the roast at different points to serve depending on your request. This usually means the rare or medium-rare roasts are not as good as they could have been where a restuarant specifically prepared an entire roast for that target temperature.[/i:8fec73f8db]
[b:8fec73f8db]I've probably cooked a thousand standing rib roasts for restaurants across the country and I have always used very similar methods as this recipe. Lots of different rubs, but always prefer the low temp method. I've also added wine, different vegetables, and stocks.. but mostly to setup for the jus I make later. I've also managed to alter the natural flavor of the meat but don't think thats a good thing. To the point of why I am even posting... there is many techniques restaurants use to serve prime rib, but the most common from my experience is cooking the roast to rare and maintaining that temperature during service. Once the customer orders their desired temperature, its usually brought up to the desired temperature in a jus thats usually then served along side it.
This is the first forum I've read so far on this site, but I am very impressed and find it very informational.
Thanks[/b:8fec73f8db]
Interesting reading all the comments about the various cooking times and methods. I do prefer the high heat at first then low heat, but may reverse that this year.
Anyways how far in advance can I buy a roast and not worry abut it spoiling or whatever?
That's hard to say. A lot depends on how it was stored before you got it.
Real Engineer's dont cook, they have their Conductors buy them food! Lol! Im a Locomotive Engineer and happened upon this website while attempting to cook a prime rib. If all works out, free rides for all on the Long Island Railroad. Keep it on the rails!
ref buying the roast in advance -
from my butcher I always see them bring it out in the vacuumed sealed "big cut" -
I typically specific amount by number of ribs - I would not recommend less than three ribs for this method.
then I do the home method of dry aging.
place on smallest platter/low rimmed pan I can fit, on a rack, covered with a cloth towel, bottom back of refrigerator.
rotate 180 degrees every 24 hrs; change towel as / if it becomes bloody/soiled.
allow to stand for five days. because the home fridge is not as well controlled (temp & humidity) as 'professional' dry aging,
max five days is recommended for safety.
the meat can lose up to 20% of it's weight - water evaporating.
trim any hard crusty spots, season with rub of choice, low temp (275'F) roasting.
results are fantastic - tender and very flavorful.
On the 18th on November Lowes had Oregon Scientific (Model AW131) wireless temperatute probes for ~$14.00 each. This is around $30.00 less than I found on-line. I am going to use it for our standing rib roast Thanksgiving dinner. Thanks for the recipe.
Please use a large muffin tin (holds 6) The flat style of doing yorkshire does not do it justice at all!!!
sw
Let me add another data point here. I started with a 9.5 lbs standing rib roast, chuck end, 3 bones, and dry aged for 5 days at which point I had a 9 lb roast. I took it out of the refrigerator 1½ hours before I inserted the probe thermometer and put it in a 200F oven on convection roast cycle (I don’t know the difference, but I have convection bake one rack, convection bake multi-racks, convection roast, and convection dehydrate cycles, convection roast creates a very nice crust).
0:00 – removed from refrigerator
1:30 – insert probe thermometer (36F) and put in 200 F convection roast oven
2:00 – 38F
4:00 – 86F (at this point, my roast was going to be done too early so I reduced temp to 190F convection roast)
4:30 – 99F (I reduced again to 175 convection roast)
4:45 – 107F
5:30 – 121F
6:00 – 128F
6:15 – 130F
6:25 – 132F, removed from oven and allowed to rest
7:00 – 135F
7:25 – 136F, this is the highest temperature achieved, back in oven at 500F convection for crust development
7:40 – 136F, removed from oven for rest
8:10 – 136F, cut and served. A bit too done for my taste of medium rare.
Some notes of interest:
1) Taking the roast out of the refrigerator early to warm to room temperature achieved absolutely nothing. To get “near room temperature” would take far longer than a couple of hours.
2) At 200 F, my cook time is less than 30 minutes/lb to achieve desired doneness.
3) At 175F, my temperature carry-over was 4F.
4) The doneness was very uniform.
5) Before putting it in the oven, I rubbed with oil, 2 tsp. kosher salt, and 2 tsp. fresh ground black pepper, the crust was amazing.
6) Next time I get a loin end roast, cook at 175F, remove from oven at no higher internal temperature than 128F for rest prior to cooking at 500F to make the crust.
Ken -
200'F is a bit more on the meat smoking scale than roasting - I'd suggest upping the oven temp to 275'F.
that low temp long heat soak also resulted in the "done thru and thru, and too much done, at that" result.
when you think about it, if you want outer layer crisp&crusty, to some depth of brown done, but inside medium rare - you can't let the whole chunk of meat come to a stable / steady state temperature. at that point, it's all done "the same"
convection vs. conventional: convection circulates the air more vigorously; with long roast time, not recommended. the whole purpose of convection is "make it happen faster" which is not what you set out to do.
Dilbert, it looks like Ken did a pretty good job at following the directions - In fact, I'd still recommend 200°F for the oven temp, but since he's using a conventional oven, you'll have to either disable the circulation or reduce the cooking time. Now that Ken's got a set of data points, his next attempt will probably be timed differently.
Evenly cooked is the point of this recipe. Pulling out at 130°F would give Ken as much meat as possible at medium-rare. I like forming the crust earlier with a sear in the pan or on a grill over high heat and then performing a slow roast to get as much of the interior at the desired temperature.
Yep.
When I smoke, I use 175-200F. But there is not much use in smoking unless you are using wood fuel. I am not sure I would risk a standing rib roast to smoking, mostly because that is a pretty hefty investment to not turn out good. If someone esle smokes one, I would be happy to taste a sample...
Actually I was trying to achieve the maximum amount of medium rare, basically medium rare through and through with a crust on the outside - any other way than the lowest possible temperature wouldn't achieve this same result. Once you got past the depth of the crust, which was just on the ouside, you got some slightly more done in the next 1/4", and the remainder of the roast was very uniform - exactly as I had hoped. However very uniform 136F (132F removal temperature with 4F carry-over) was still more done than I like, apparently I prefer rarer than this (this was my first time cooking standing rib roast, although certainly not my first time eating prime rib). The results as to uniform doneness were as I had hoped and my process is not likely to change next time except that I will try with convection disabled and will remove the roast at a lower temperature.
I had never convection roasted this low before. In the past on smaller roasts and more conventional temperatures, I have found that convection roast cycle doesn't appreciably reduce cooking time so much as it really forms a nice outside crust. Perhaps my cooking times are reduced, but at relatively small amounts that fall into the point of being negligible? However with a much longer and lower temperature roast time the convection factor is perhaps no longer negligible (I could only verify this by cooking another standing rib roast without it - yum). I can certainly disable the convection fan, however there is something clearly more to convection than simply a fan as my oven has four different convection cycles.
This is a great site.
Ken -
"ye olde kitchen oven" is subject to temperature striations - you've certainly heard the ye olde standard line "rotate the xxxx to ensure even cooking / browning / whatever"
[[something clearly more to convection]]
yes and no; and of course the ever popular "mebbe"
convection is simply forced air circulation attempting to put the entire oven volume "more closer to the set point"
there's slow air fan, fast air fan, separate heating element 'boosters' to heat the air while it's circulating, low booster heat, high booster heat, and of where from it sucks and whereto it blasts.
for 'exposed' items, drying - ala the crust formation - is more pronounced. convection cooking a roast in a covered pot will not dry it out. . . .
if you have a heat booster in the convection air stream, that can affect 'crust' as the air exiting the convection ports is higher than the set point.
the low temp is indeed suited to your aim for medium rare (xCrust) throughout. I misread your initial post - I actually prefer Crust+Medium+Rare outer to bone - and have found the high temps help create that gradient.
If you have guests that prefer their meat more well-done than others, I'd recommend the following tip that my sister-in-law told me (it's what they do in her restaurant):
1. Cook roast to medium rare (or rare if that's what you like)
2. Heat-up some au-jus in a large pot, keeping it at low heat ( you'll need enough to completely cover a carved piece of your roast)
3. Dip any piece you want cooked more into the au-jus and wait
I don't have cooking times, but it will only take a couple of minutes to change the done-ness "level".
It's also a good way to give everyone a nice warm piece since you can do a quick dip right before serving.
I just saw an Alton Brown special that recommends searing /after/ slow cooking... his claim is that doing it in that order will keep more juice in the meat. Sure enough, not much au jus was visible in his roasting pan...
Anyone try that method?
link:
http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/recipes/recipe/0,1977,FOOD_9936_17372,00.html
I am getting a 9-rib roast for christmas, and i am going to cut it at 5 ribs and have a 4 rib left over. I am cutting it like this to fit it in the oven. My question is, do i cook both of the rib roasts the same amount of time as if it were a whole 9 rib roast or do i cook them as if i were cooking a 5 rib roast? Thank you
YES I HAVE COOKED THE ROAST LIKE ALTON BROWN, ACTUALLY ITS THE ONLY WAY I EVER COOKED IT. I COOK IT @ 225 AND THEN THE LAST 30 MINS I TURN THE HEAT UP TO 350-400 DEPENDING ON THE SIZE OF THE ROAST. IT HAS BEEN SOOOOOOO DELICIOUS ITS NOT EVEN FUNNY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It'll end up closer to the time it takes for a 4-5 rib roast than for a 9-rib roast due to the extra surface area on the two extra end pieces you are exposing. However, I've found that the total time for a 4-5 rib roast doesn't differ drastically from that of a 9-rib (which is what I've got in the oven right now).
thanks for the quick response and happy roasting!!!! Hopefully you are eating it as i speak, thats a wonderful thing!
"... USDA grade it recieved." REC-E-I-VED, not REC-I-E-VED...
Fixed. Messages like this can be e-mailed instead of going into comments.
Hello all,
Just wanted to post and let the world know that this is the way to do it. I will be making dinner this year for Christmas. This will be the third time using this page for guidance. Every time I make this roast it has come out perfect and my guests continue to rave about how tasty it is. Cheers for providing a valuable service. Thank you very much.
Merry Christmas!
Matthew
Hello..
I am having 10 people for dinner on Christmas. First time preparing a prime rib... Question. We'd like to use our rotisseri, how to I calculate time. Biggest problem... half of my quests like well done... the other half med rare. Any suggestions on pleasing both. Should I do 2 separate small roasts.. and adjust cooking time for both or????
Thank you..
DEFINITELY do two smaller roasts. Start them both at the same time, take the medium rare out when it is done, and let the well done continue to cook. When the medium rare is half done, just rotate the roasts in the oven so they both get even heating. Each group will think you did a good job.
There is no way you will get roughly equal amounts of meat that are half medium rare and half well done.
Wonderful site!
I have a 15 pound boneless rib roast. It's close 22 inches long with a diameter of 8 inches or so. Does the 45 minute guideline still apply if I follow the recipe as outlined at the beginning of this blog? That calculates to 11.25 hours in the oven after browning? is that right? just seems like a long time for anything to be in the oven. Also, does the fact that there are no bones in it affect the cooking time? Thank you!
Eric
I've got a 13.8lb standing rib roast dry aging in the oven, ala Alton Brown.
I was planning on doing his recipe of cooking at 200 degrees, (he said about 4 hours for a 10lb roast to get to an internal temp of 118deg, expecting 10-12 degrees of carry over heat), then firing up the oven to 500 to form a crust.
(BTW Im a finance guy so I did this in spreadsheets...)
Used Alton's plan to extrapolate my own:
http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/recipes/recipe/0,,FOOD_9936_17372,00.html
The show is also available on YouTube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmfaeWEjGpM
Alton's Temp:
118 Degrees Internal Temp Reached
240 Minutes
10 lb roast
24 Minutes Per lb
10-12 Deg Carry Over to get to 130deg medium rare
Therefore, to get a 10lb roast to an internal temp of 126, I need
[1+((126-118)/118)] x 240 Minutes = 256 Minutes, therefore I expect to need (25.6 min x 14 lbs) =358 minutes (6 Hrs) Roasting to reach 126 Degrees, which I want to carry over into the low range of medium (138deg) as follows:
Final Temps: Midpoint:
Rare 120 to 127 123.5
Medium Rare 128 to 135 131.5
Medium 136 to 146 140.5
So the big variables here, that conflict with the recipe on Cooking for Engineers, are -
1) Should I expect 10degrees of carry over heat?
2) What do you think this medium will look like? I want pink throughout, but not bloody.
3)45 Minutes per pound at 200??? My math gets me close to 26.
I'd appreciate your thoughts on my approach- it basically assumes linear relationships, since I know nothing about thermodynamics, it is all I had to work with.
If you look back a few posts I had a ? similar to yours, it was about the 9 rib roast which is going to be about 20lbs, anyway from hearing from others I hear that the cooking time beetween a 4-5 rib roast and a nine rib roast isnt all that different. I recently cooked a 4 ribber and it took about 4 hours if i remember correctly. I can positively tell you from my experience that 11 hours is way way to long. It should take around 4-6. do yourself a large favor go to walmart and get yourself a digital oven thermometer that runs into the oven and into the meat, you can leave the display out on the counter and it will beep at your temperature. If you are cooking it and people start getting antsy because its taking a while just crank the heat up for the last hour or so and it will still come out delicious. and I also would rather make people wait a little longer to have it hot and fresh than have it done to early!!!!! hope i ahve helped you out!
I dont agree with those temperatures. i get my steak to about 135 then take it out of the oven and it is still mighty red, not pink at all, I dont like raw meat, I guess its all preference.
Ps make sure your oven is clean before cooking!!!!!!!
Ha, this is true - I would hate to think of it getting soggy waiting for people to sit down to eat. Knowing my type of crowd though, if we have to wait an extra hour or two, we'll be too drunk to eat.
I'm going to split the difference and go for 5 hours- I'll start roasting around 12.
I have the digital thermometer, I'm just concerned that if I pull it kind of early, I won't get enough carry heat increase to let it keep cooking.
Alton says there was 10deg of carryover on his roast - but the other posters here saw much less - even at the same 200 degree roasting temperature.
5 hours is probably a decent estimate - my last roast was a 15 pound boneless and at 225F it was going to finish in 4 hours. I had to drop the temperature to 170F to slow down the cooking (and then picked it up to 250 about an hour before I needed it done) so it would finish at the right time.
I had about 3 degrees carryover during the 50 minute rest. I carved prime rib for the next 45 minutes and there was still enough warmth in the last piece that I served.
listen to the others in here! When i take it out of the oven i never get that carryover either. I eat the meat medium rare, and i pull it out around 140-145 and the meat is still very red. I think 135 would be way too early. who wants purple meat?!! ps i cook at 225,
So when you pull the roast with an internal temp of 140-145, it is still very red? Can you describe the redness a bit better? all of the charts Ive seen would put a 145 degree roast firmly in the medium zone.
I am pretty put off by the discrepencies in the amount of carry over heat people say to expect. I don't want to overcook this thing.
keep in mind:
not all thermometers are accurate
not all cooks use accurate technique
I have an old metal dial type from my aunt. it reads 12F' different than these newfangled 'lectronic thingies. perfectly good thermometer, tho, eh?
bone in / boneless makes a big difference in the amount of carry over I have seen. bones seem to be a heat sink . . .
sticking the thermometer so far as to hit the bone will produce a false reading. to be safe, I stick it in to where I _think_ is right, then I move in an inch both ways to make sure I'm not off by 50 degrees.
the higher the roasting temperature, the more carry over you get because (a) the overall time is shorter - some advice is roasting at 350'F
(b) there is less time for the higher temp to penetrate all the way through
if you pull the roast, allow it to cool, then stick in back in at 500'F to crust it, you'll get little to no "carry over" from the crusting bit.
Michael brought in "the voice of experience" - start your roast, check the temp and the time, raise/lower the temp based on how much time is left and the temp reached.
I start 4-5 ribs, bone in, at 235'F - I find the fat renders off a bit better with more than 200'F.
using the low temp long roast time approach I've never seen 10F' carryover. I wouldn't count on anything more than 4 or 5 F'
did you see the trick posted: keep a shallow pan of simmering broth handy - if you run out of "not done enough" slice it and put the slice in for a few laps in the broth pool . . .
oh, do NOT use the microwave to nuke it more done; this stuff is much too expensive for use on shoes.
I do hope your comment about dry aging the roast in the oven was a typo - the fridge is a better spot . . . .
For absolute accuracy and precision, I like my Thermapen. They come with a serial number and the name of the inspector/calibration person when you buy it. You can use it to calibrate your other thermometers by placing them in a pot of water and seeing how they all register. I calibrated my Polder oven probe thermometer with it, and it was within a degree or two. DON'T use a thermapen to repeatedly check your prime rib. The holes you poke in it will drain out all the juice. You can also use a fever thermometer and calibrate your cooking thermometer--at least to the 100F/body temperature range, which should be close enough for cooking beef in the rare/medium range. At least you'll eliminate those thermometers that are way off.
Only problem I have with "the voice of experience" is that if the roast is done an hour or more later, won't it keep cooking if I stick it back in the oven? I have a brand new probe thermometer and oven thermometer, I'm counting on them. I'm thinking I may do 235 deg though, because I like the idea of rendering the fat. I'm used to cooking ribeye steaks by searing and throwing in them into a hot oven (500deg) for 2 minutes on each side.
Yep, aging in the fridge, not the oven, ha, I didnt notice that before.
so I guess I'll take the roast out of the oven when I wake up in the morning, let it sit in it's plastic aging box til it gets closer to room temp, and start at 235deg for 5 hours around Noon.
I'll adjust my calcs for 5 degrees of carry over cooking, and still try to land on the low range of medium. (135-138).
>> if the roast is done an hour or more later, won't it keep cooking if I stick it back in the oven?
I'm not following the thought here . . .
starting at room temp I suspect 5 hours is going to be a bit on the long side - but that's better than the short side because if you graph out time vs temp, assuming it is reasonably linear (works at low temp roasting) you can see at mid-time-point how it's doing and adjust.
forward thinking / planning is required - you can't wait until 45 minutes before sitting down to discover the roast internal temp is 100'F and jack up the temp to 500'
if the roast finishes early - take it out to stand, cover with foil & "insulation" i.e. towel/etc - it will stay warm for a good 30 minutes.
first time I did one I read some cookbook and started roasting at 350' -
checked the temp and the roast was _way_ ahead of schedule - I simply turned off the oven, left the roast in the oven - started again after 90 minutes.
I find the cooking times based on weight to be unreliable with a long piece of meat like a rib roast. Whether you are cooking a 3-rib roast or a 7-rib roast, the thickness is the same. Sure, you have cooking from the ends, but most of the heat has to penetrate through the sides. So, I don't see much difference in cooking time related to "length" of the prime rib.
I am doing a 12 lb. boneless rib roast on Christmas, using the Alton Brown slow roast method (start low, pull out at 120 degrees, rest for 30 minutes, heat oven to 500 degrees, put meat back in to sear for about 10 minutes). I'm figuring on about four hours to get to 120, a half-hour to rest, ten minutes to sear, 10 minutes to rest and 10 minutes to cut, totaling five hours.
I am thinking about starting an hour earlier and leave time to turn the heat off and let it oven rest, but the lowest my oven goes is 170 degrees. I can't turn it down to 120-130 degrees. Any thoughts?
Your oven, previously at 500 for the sear won't go down to 120-130 for quite a while anyway, so I wouldn't use that. You could place it on a pan and keep the roast in a picnic type cooler which will keep the heat of the roast in.
:lol: Do I need to cover this with a lid or foil?
I have a 10.5 lb bone in roast. I am dry aging it using the towel fridge method. I will be cooking it in a weber grill with rotiserie at about 200. How long do I need to plan on cooking it. I am going to use Alton Browns method of finishing at high temp for the crust. I am going to use a probe thermometer, but cannot monitor on the outside of the grill because fo the rotiserie. Please help!
Thanks! Terry
Hi Terry, I dont know what the situation looks like but i would get a plain meat thermometer and stick it in the meat and tie it to the meat with some butchers twine,then it should be able to spin and get the temperature at the same time, I dont know how but improvise!!
I have a dilemma - 18lbs prime rib, will pan sear, season, set oven to 200.
Will stick 2 thermometers - analog and digital oven - want to get roast to medium 145 internal temp.
At 45 minutes per pound for an 18lbs roast to get to 145 - looking at 14 hours -- many have commented that this is TOO long.
Can others who have roasted large roast in and around the 18lbs please comment on time? Is 14 hours TOO long or should I be looking in and around half that time to get to a MEDIUM roast???
Thanks
That is my plan, but my problem is I need a ballpark done time to start opening the lid to check the temp. Don't want to have to open a lot because of heat loss. Does 4 hours sound about right??
here are several ROT's:
large roast + 10-11 lbs cut in half, distance to oven walls makes a difference.
use low/slow method, 200 F, until thermo reads 10 F, under target.
let rest foil covered until internal temp stops rising, no matter how long it takes.
remove thermo, plug thermo hole with clean golf tee.
set oven at max temp. brown to desired crustiness.
rest covered loosely with foil 10-15 minutes minimum.
Would like to see discussion based on total energy expended, BTU's per hour
etc
I am most certainly not an engineer. My Dad was, however, an Electrical Engineer at KSC for many years on the Shuttle Support Team. Though we often laughed at his inability to program the VCR (my son did it for him) we always respected him for his unquestioned brilliance. I love the way you put together the recipes and know that he would be proud.
We will dedicate this Christmas Standing Rib Roast to him and all those other slide rule engineers of the past and present.
what is the difference between a beef rib club roast and a standard rib roast - how do I cook it?? time and temp?
Any one know about cooking a pork shoulder roast?? time? temp?
HELP!!! I have a 12-bone standing rib roast that will barely fit into my oven. What do I do now? I know to bring it to room temperature and cook to approx 130F but, approximately how long will it take for this monster??? Thanks for any help.
<< 12-bone standing rib roast
cut it in half and figure on 4-5 hrs at 200 - 235'F
bonbon -
marketing names are always fascinating
see: http://www.meattrack.com/URMISfancifulNames.php
for the club rib roast
:P I have made several prime ribs using the slow roasting method described in this recipe and the 45 minutes per lb, always renders a perfect roast. My oven tends to run cool so I cook it at 215 degrees. I also make a crust of diced onion, garlic, salt and coarse ground black pepper. I season the roast with this and try to let it sit on the counter and come to close to room temperature with the seasoning coating on it, this can take up to a few hours depending on the size of the cut of beef. Another better seasoning crust is made with Regas seasoning for those of you in the Knoxville, Tn Area. Just coat sit and cook for a mouth watering dinner. I also like to add whole mushrooms to the baking dish when it has about an hour left to cook.
I've read every post and here's what I've decided:
I'm about to start my 10 pounder
2 hours at room temperature then
225 degress until 130 for med with 5 degree carryover
I'm expecting 25 min per pound.
I just can't decide, sear first or last?
sear at end.
you'll get some crusting during "whatever" roasting method you choose -
searing at end allows for adjustments to potentially non-anticipated results. . . .
Just cooked a 16 lb roast this morning. Left roast at room temperature for five hours. Scheduled to cook from 4AM til 930 AM @ 200 Degrees F....Checked roast @ 8AM and found it was 125 Degrees F. I removed roast from the oven and "finished" from 8AM til 11AM. @ about 9AM it was 136 Degrees F. We dined at noon and the roast was a perfect 122 Degrees F. Everyone absolutely LOVED the roast!!!!Thanks for all the suggestions. ;)
I just cooked a 6 Rib - 11lb Prime Rib w/Dry Rub Herbs.
After looking at all the great post above I finally did the following.
(NOTE:) Having gotten up late, I put the roast in the oven w/o allowing any time to set on the counter. The roast was 40 deg F when I placed it in the oven.
I preheated the oven to 450 deg F, but the second I place the roast in I dropped the temp to 200 def F, this seared the rub on very nicely. After 2 hours time, I raised the temp to 225 deg F (An above poster said they had better luck removing the fat at this temp). At 4 hours time, I had a core Temp of 115 deg F, and by the end of the 5th hour it was at 125 deg F.
I removed it from the oven, seperated the Roast from the Ribs and placed it on a platter to allow it to finish and collect some juices, (Be sure to cover roast in Foil). I only saw about a 4 deg rise in the core temp. The Meat was a perfect Medium Rare, even the endcaps were no more than Medium
For the Au Jus I took a 14oz can of Beef Broth, and and boiled off reminants from pan, added Salt, Black Pepper, and Red Pepper (optional) to taste.
I thank all the above Poster's for your great suggestion, Information, and Ideas.
Okay, folks. I'm not an engineer - yet. I'm a senior on a PhD path. Anyway, my Texas Smoker credentials are more relevant here than my formal education. That being said I'd like to add my two cents to the discussion, especially since it looks like some folks have inquired as to the efficacy of barbecueing a rib roast.
For Christmas Eve this year (yesterday) I cooked a 16 lb boneless rib roast. I bought it cryovac'd at Costco a week early and left it to wet age in it's own juices in the meat drawer of my fridge at 39 degrees Farenheit. I find that's a much safer way to age and it doesn't stink up your fridge.
At 9:30 AM I removed the roast from the fridge and washed it thoroughly, then left it uncovered in a cold oven to drip and warm. At 10:30AM I removed the roast from the oven, drained the juices and water, and proceeded to dress it. I rubbed a light coating of yellow mustard on the oustide, then canola oil, and finally a coating of kosher salt, lots of freshly cracked black pepper, and a tiny bit of onion powder. Then I placed it back in the oven to further warm (oven still OFF).
At 11:00 AM I started the fire in the smoker (custom smoker with offset firebox). I used approximately 10lb of Kingsford charcoal (NOT the mesquite kind) for early even high heat, and added large chunks of Hickory wood for smoke and flavor. After cleaning the grill surface and allowing the pit to heat evenly, I place the rib roast on the pit at 11:30 AM. I added more hickory chunks and allowed the roast to sit for 30 minutes - fat side down - while the temperature slowly varied from an initial temp of 400 down to 220 F. At that point I simply rotated the roast every 30-35 minutes and tried to keep a temp of 220-250. I know my pit fairly well so the temp stayed a fairly consistent 235 (1 inch above grill surface). You can also place a thermometer in the smoke stream of the pit being careful to not let it touch anything and verify the exit temp that way, though it will be a bit cooler than the internal temp of the pit. Anyway, I cooked the roast this way until 4:30PM, rotating it 180 degrees verically, but never horizontally. I then raised the temp of the pit by placing mesquite logs over the coals to bring the temp back up to roughly 450 degrees for 20 minutes (internal temp of 128 on the end furthest from the heat, 132 on the end furthest from the heat). At 4:50 I removed the roast to a disposable roasting pan, tented it, and left it to rest on my stovetop.
It lost less than a cup of juice in the pan over the next 30 minutes and final temps were 135 on one end and 140 on the other. The outer crust was phenomenal and the meat was extremely tender and beautifully pink on one end and slightly less so on the other. I did this because some of my guests prefer their meat slightly more "done" than others. If I wanted a more uniformly cooked roast I would simply rotate the meat vertically AND horizontally when smoking it.
To be fair, this is more barbecueing than smoking due to the temps, but it turns out so great that none of my guests complained.
Well, here's hoping some of you try smoking a rib roast. It's a flavor you simply cannot achieve in an oven - conventional OR convection. Oh, and don't fret over rib roasts so much, folks. It's pretty darn hard to mess it up as long as you don't overcook it! If you pull it out too early and it's still a bloody mess just fire up the grill, slap some butter on and make the most delicious ribeye steaks your guests have ever had!
I had a 9 lb roast from Safeway. I miscalcuated the time - I kept thinking it would take 4.5 hours at 200 deg. I was planning on getting it the oven at 12:30, which would be ready for dinner at 6pm.
I took the roast out of the fridge at about 10:30am. At 11am I realized I miscalculated the time, that 45min per pound is 6.75hrs, not 4.5. Dumb.
I preheated the oven to 450 deg. Put the roast in at 11:15, immediately turned it down to 250 deg. At 1:40pm, the temp was 90 deg. At 3:15pm, the roast was done - 130 deg.
I tented the roast and we ended up eating at 5pm. It was near perfect, and I got rave reviews from family.
For Christmas we only had 4 people, so I did a 4-lb roast. I undid the strings, cut off the bone, and seared it for a few minutes directly over the coals in my little Weber. Then I put it in my smoker, over a pan of water, and set the smoker on the Weber right over the coals, using a Taylor meat thermometer with a cable probe to keep track of the temp. I took it off in 1 hr 15 minutes at 115° F, let it rise to 125°, and it was just perfect: medium rare toward the edges and blood rare in the middle. We all thought it was yummy!
Michel
yup - I had a four rib ca. ten pounder
put it in at 235'F
at +2 hours center was about 95'F - increased oven temp to 250'F
at +3 hours center was about 110'F - increased oven temp to 265'F
removed at +4 hours; 125'F center temp
rested 20 minutes.
crispy outside
medium outer muscle group.
clear juice, red, hot rare at the bone.
all gone at +4.4 hours.
the spaetzle should last so long . . .
How many people did your 10 lbs roast feed, and were the rib bones left on it? Sounds great.
Steve
that from cynicalb_repost was 2005 - might not hear anything . . .
but anyway, I did a ten pounder off the small end, bone in, four ribs.
the butcher left a bit more fat than I would have preferred (weight wise) - however it went for six with a extra thick slice leftover. no one went for a second slice - so depending on the appetite sizes involved you could get less.
Since I benefited from others experiences, thought I would add my own:
10 lb prime rib
1 hr at room temp
preheat to 450 deg
lower to 200 when roast is inserted.
0.0hr 39
1.0hr 46
2.0hr 68
3.0hr 92
4.0hr 112
4.5hr 120, temp increase to 220.
5.0hr 127
5.5hr 135, removed, start resting.
6.0hr 140
(33 minutes per pound)
30 minute rest.
I would call it ... med-well side of medium. More than I hoped, but edible at least, which is good for me :)
quite a bit of juice (~1 cup) "leaked" out during slicing. Hard to quantify, but easily a cup. I suspect a long rest would have helped there.
Thanks Eddie for the feedback on your using a smoker for your standing rib roast. I can control my smoker pretty well, but as you know this only comes from experience and using wood isn't quite as forgiving as using natural gas or electricity. Based on your comments, I will definitely try smoking a standing rib roast next time.
Okay, okay - I already found out I blew it by purchasing a 2.05# prime rib (don't laugh - it's for my husband and ME, and we're not big eaters!). I'm sure the butcher got his laugh for the day when he sold it to me. But...the deed is done and I need to cook it -- medium rare. I've read comments to treat it like a big steak - how so? Is there any way I can cook this and end up with a lovely juicy red piece of meat. Help - this is our New Year's dinner.
Hi Moo -
I suspect not all is lost. the key is to roast it at a low temperature so the outside doesn't go crispy critter before the inside gets warm.
rub down with your favorite spices/seasonings - coarse salt & fresh coarsely cracked pepper at a minimum.
roast at 225'F - probably will not take more than 90 minutes if the oven if preheated and the roast is short of frozen.
do you have a thermometer to follow the interior temp? go for 135'F then pull it, cover and rest for 10-15 minutes.
thanks, dilbert. i'll try it - i really appreciate the advice and yes, i do have a thermometer.
Don't worry, you can still save face. I'm sure the butcher thought you were having it as a large juicy steak. :)
On a ribeye (steak) rib roast that size, probably one good sized rib width, I would pull it at 130 absolute tops and let it rest or else it will be medium by the time you eat it. Temperature is going to be critical because it is a small roast. Don't overshoot your temp.
Happy New Year!
Its time for us on the east coast to get ready to party!
I cooked a 16.25 lb standing rib roast last night, starting at 500 degrees, which I immediately reduced to 200 after depositing the Main Guest, which had been coated in olive oil and Montreal Steak Seasoning.
The roast had been out of the refrigerator for two hours before hitting the oven. Internal temperature 15 minutes after going in the oven was 44 degrees. It took 6 hours and 10 minutes to get to 128 at which time I pulled it. It continued to cook, reaching 133 after 35 minutes. I couldn't wait any longer so I sliced it then. It was a perfect medium-rare throughout, right out to the edges, and gave up practically no juice or fat in the cooking or at slicing, and was extremely tender and juicy.
The best roast I ever cooked, and my guests were amazed at how good it tasted. Several said it surpassed the best restaurant prime rib they had ever eaten. Ten of them went through more than half of it, less the bones, for which I have plans today.
Thanks very much to all the people who advised of their experiences here. All were very helpful, and I hope this is helpful to someone, too.
Here's the breakdown on my cook time.
2:00pm
Started my 9# roast after preheating at 200*F and continue cooking at 200*F.
6:45pm
At 6:45pm the roast looked a bit pale @ 125*F (internal temp) so I ramped it up to 450*F for 15 minutes.
7:00pm
Backed down temp to 200*F (internal temp was about 127*F)
7:15pm
Removed from oven at 130*F.
7:30pm
After sitting for about ~15 minutes internal temp was at 134*F.
Results:
End cuts were about med
Rest of the cuts were about med rare. :) Very tasty & juicy prime rib! Thanks and HAPPY NEW YEAR!
-Wilson
:)
Just wanted to share my results.
My roast was just over 5lbs and I used a 200' oven but I would not recommend basing your cooking time on 45mins/pound. I put mine in the oven based on that figure and it hit the target temp of 118' about an hour early. It took 2hrs and 20mins to hit 118' at which point I removed the roast from the oven, covered it with foil and let it rest a bit while I let the oven come up to 500'. Put the roast back in to brown for only about 10mins (this made me kind of nervous as the temp had already climbed perilously close to 128' for medium rare). I wanted my roast to be just below medium rare as I knew I'd be reheating the leftovers and would much rather it be slighly undercooked than over. Anyway, after browning it for about 10mins in the 500' oven I took it out and let it rest for about 30mins. Perfect (aside from being done about an hour early). Yum!
As seen in the Neiman Marcus catalog.
http://www.neimanmarcus.com/store/catalog/productImagesPopup.jhtml?selected=mg&item=prod36640147&pageProductId=prod36640147&yB=mg_prod36640147
I am thinking ...
beef broth made from roasting drippings,
canned beef broth + canned chicken broth or water to create soup volume,
Add 4 T flour combined with 2-3 T butter to thicken,
Cook on Med heat until thickened
Add lots of sauteed mushrooms
Add carmelized onions
heavy cream or sour cream at end of cooking chowder
Add cubed leftover prime rib, just to warm meat up
What do YOU think Mr. Chu ?
Smoothies suck. Steaks rock.
Im making a 15# roast, boneless, for easter. tried your method with a standing rib roast and had to up the time to 51 min per pound. any other ideas as this way would take close to 13 hours to cook, me thinks. Help! thanks in advance!
Why would this take 13 hours to cook? You can't estimate time by weight since surface area increases as well when you roast gets bigger and roasts basically only get longer, not uniformly bigger. My guess is it won't take longer than 6-7 hours.
Hi All,
Has anyone tried any rotisserie rib? I have a four rib (8 lb) that I am doing tomorrow in the rotisserie. I am just curious on the comparison between the classic oven variations and the rotisserie?
Real engineer here. (Eagle Group, food service equipment manufacturer)
I have engineered a Cook And Hold cabinet (CH6000) and the owner of our company wanted me to show some out of town sales reps how good it will cook prime rib. As we wanted to be sure it was done in plenty of time, and wanted to cook it overnight, we looked on the net for slow cooking instructions. I read enough of the postings to see that some people said it would take less and others said it would take all 45 minutes. It was a 14lb 7.4oz roast,200˚F at 45 minutes a pound would put it done 10 hours and 51 minutes. We put it in at 10:00pm (yep, made a special trip back to work to get the roast in the cabinet) figuring that it would be done around 9:00.
This may be a good time to fill in everyone about the cabinet. It is a convection "oven" that is plumbed directly into a water source to keep the humidity level up (moist meat). Digital controls, temperature probe, indefinite holding at another specified temperature...
Well, when we got here at 6:30am, it was already in hold mode. The clock indicated that it was done cooking around 3:00am. I stuck in a regular meat thermometer and the core temperature was 128˚F. When I finally cut the roast at 11:50 IT WAS BEAUTIFUL!!! From the first slice, it was as pink as a rare meat eater would want it to be cooked. Every slice was the same way. The roast was just as tender as it could be... So, my cooking time was about 21 minutes a pound, but the temperature probe did its job and put it into a hold temperature of 130˚F (instead of a Polder beeping at me)
Slow cooking is the way to cook prime rib!!! Thank you very much!!!
I've written a few articles on prime rib cooking since I posted this one to Cooking For Engineers, so I can't remember if I've mentioned it before on CFE (because I know I've discussed it elsewhere):
Cooking time for prime rib cannot be calculated by X minutes per pound.
I'll try to put together a newer, more up-to-date prime rib article.
hi michael, great website you have here. i love the recipes and so does my family. my mother's bringing home a 2 kilo rib roast today, and i'd just like to clarify: when tying the roast, i tie it around, once at each end, between the ribs? um, sort of like a wrapped candy that's tied at the ends?
once again, compliments on this site. so far i've made the chocolate truffles, mushroom soup, chicken pot pie, pancakes, lamb chops, all to great success. and my mother loves your tiramisu recipe.
by the way, on the recipe card, you convert 200 F to 90 F; i'm sure you mean 90 deg C.
You only need to tie this roast if you've cut off the bones already (some butchers do it to make it easier to serve later - but if they do, they usually tie them back on for you). If that's the case, you just tie the roast between the ribs - no need for the other direction. If the ribs are intact, no need to tie this roast at all.
And this is why I love the web - I can fix typos discovered years later! I've actually updated it to 95 degrees C. Thanks for catching that!
Hi there,
I've never cooked a prime rib before. I'm doing an 11 lb. roast for Thanksgiving. There's no mention of whether to cover the roast or not--what is your preference? Also, at 200 degrees x 11 lbs. I will be cooking the roast for 8 hrs???? Can that be right? Thanks for the help!
uncovered.
slow cooking time varies a bit -
items that cause this:
slight/moderate/wild oven actual temps for the indicated setting
amount of moisture in the roast (ie fresh vs dry aged)
bone to meat mass ratio
to answer your question, can it really take 8 hours? at 200'F, yes.
convection oven add more variability - convection is not assumed in this slow cook method.
it is absolutely essential to use a thermometer and check the internal temps as you go along. if it's going too fast you have adequate notice to turn the oven down/off in getting the guests and the food ready at the same time.
if you have the option to get a dry aged roast from a good butcher, go for it. stuff in the supermarkets is not dry aged; you can do this at home - 3 days makes a difference, 5 days is max. in the home refrig.
On January 02, 2008 I made a 9# roast and for Thanksgiving I we made a slightly smaller one at 7#. This one came out perfect again. YUM!
Here's the break down for 7# roast.
==7# Roast==
Rub- fresh garlic/rosemary and course sea salt/black pepper and garlic salt
Standing temp 46*F
Preheat 200*F and continue cooking at 200*F
9:30am Enters oven at 200*F
12:00pm (internal temp - 107*F)
12:45pm (internal temp - 125*F Set temp to 450*F)
1:10pm Exit oven (internal temp - 130*F)
Wrap in foil
1:20PM Removed foil when internal temp was 135*F and let sit to 140*F before carving.
1:30pm Late lunch! :) Perfect medium-medium rare cuts. Delicious!
Wilson :)
Thanks to everyone for all these great tips ... After reading, I made my first ever prime roast (for Thanksgiving) and it was fork tender ... Perhaps the best I've eaten anywhere! I use a Big Green Egg, which helps make me look much more talented than I actually am :-) But the tips posted here undoubtedly saved my bacon! Thanks to all!
I am preparing for the first time Christmas eve dinner for my family at my house a delicious or I hope boneless prime rib dinner. It's approximately 6 pounds and I was wondering if because it's boneless the cooking method needs to be modified from the instructions listed above. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!! Happy Holidays
Jason -
being boneless it will cook a bit quicker - use a thermometer - essential to judge how fast it's cooking.
enjoy! prime rib is a seriously simple thing to do - season
When slicing the roast, first cut the rib bones out and then lie the roast on the cut side to carve large slices off the roast.
When properly roasted, the medium-rare pink is uniform to the edges of the roast, giving the diner the maximum amount of tender, juicy beef per slice.